Norm Van Lier
1969–70 to 1978–79 · 10 seasons
NBA player comparison
Norm Van Lier vs. Phil Chenier: Career comparison
Regular-season verdict
Norm Van Lier ranks higher in career impact
Phil Chenier
1971–72 to 1980–81 · 10 seasons
Impact comparison
Box impact estimates points per 100 possessions above each season's league average. Higher is better. Career ranks and average league finishes work the other way: lower is better.
#286LeadsCareer Impact RankPeak-weighted regular-season rank#302
+2.7Peak box impactEra-adjusted points per 100 possessions above league average · higher is better+2.9Leads
+1.4Best 5 average box impactEra-adjusted points per 100 possessions above league average · higher is better+1.7Leads
22.7Best 3 average finishAverage league place · lower is better15.0Leads
+1,482 ptsLeadsPoints above replacementCumulative regular-season value+1,188 pts
0Top-10 impact seasons1Leads
Career Impact Rank places Norm Van Lier #286 and Phil Chenier #302. It combines league finishes across each player's best three, five, and ten regular seasons, giving the most weight to the best three. Phil Chenier had the higher single-season impact estimate.
Regular season only. Impact figures are estimates; small gaps are not exact. Playoffs, awards and titles do not determine the verdict.
Career Impact RankSee exactly how both rankings are calculatedNorm Van Lier36.433 · No. 286Phil Chenier38.220 · No. 302
Only the three league-finish windows below determine Career Impact Rank. Career Value and peak impact are separate measures; neither adds points to this calculation. Lower composite scores rank higher.
Norm Van Lier
36.433 composite · No. 286 all-time
| Window and finishes used | Average finish | Weight | Contribution |
|---|---|---|---|
| Best 3No. 161972–73Reconstructed historical estimateIncludes bounded historical defense estimateNo. 221971–72Reconstructed historical estimateIncludes bounded historical defense estimateNo. 301970–71Reconstructed historical estimateIncludes bounded historical defense estimate | 22.667 | 50% | 11.333 |
| Best 5No. 161972–73Reconstructed historical estimateIncludes bounded historical defense estimateNo. 221971–72Reconstructed historical estimateIncludes bounded historical defense estimateNo. 301970–71Reconstructed historical estimateIncludes bounded historical defense estimateNo. 611973–74Recorded box inputsIncludes bounded historical defense estimateNo. 631974–75Recorded box inputsIncludes bounded historical defense estimate | 38.400 | 30% | 11.520 |
| Best 10No. 161972–73Reconstructed historical estimateIncludes bounded historical defense estimateNo. 221971–72Reconstructed historical estimateIncludes bounded historical defense estimateNo. 301970–71Reconstructed historical estimateIncludes bounded historical defense estimateNo. 611973–74Recorded box inputsIncludes bounded historical defense estimateNo. 631974–75Recorded box inputsIncludes bounded historical defense estimateNo. 771975–76Recorded box inputsIncludes bounded historical defense estimateNo. 841969–70Reconstructed historical estimateIncludes bounded historical defense estimateNo. 981976–77Recorded box inputsIncludes bounded historical defense estimateNo. 1061978–79Recorded box inputsIncludes bounded historical defense estimateNo. 1221977–78Recorded box inputsIncludes bounded historical defense estimate | 67.900 | 20% | 13.580 |
11.333 + 11.520 + 13.580= 36.433
Phil Chenier
38.220 composite · No. 302 all-time
| Window and finishes used | Average finish | Weight | Contribution |
|---|---|---|---|
| Best 3No. 91973–74Recorded box inputsIncludes bounded historical defense estimateNo. 131974–75Recorded box inputsIncludes bounded historical defense estimateNo. 231975–76Recorded box inputsIncludes bounded historical defense estimate | 15.000 | 50% | 7.500 |
| Best 5No. 91973–74Recorded box inputsIncludes bounded historical defense estimateNo. 131974–75Recorded box inputsIncludes bounded historical defense estimateNo. 231975–76Recorded box inputsIncludes bounded historical defense estimateNo. 491972–73Reconstructed historical estimateIncludes bounded historical defense estimateNo. 881976–77Recorded box inputsIncludes bounded historical defense estimate | 36.400 | 30% | 10.920 |
| Best 10No. 91973–74Recorded box inputsIncludes bounded historical defense estimateNo. 131974–75Recorded box inputsIncludes bounded historical defense estimateNo. 231975–76Recorded box inputsIncludes bounded historical defense estimateNo. 491972–73Reconstructed historical estimateIncludes bounded historical defense estimateNo. 881976–77Recorded box inputsIncludes bounded historical defense estimateNo. 1071971–72Reconstructed historical estimateIncludes bounded historical defense estimateNo. 1211977–78Recorded box inputsIncludes bounded historical defense estimateNo. 2011979–80Recorded box inputsIncludes bounded historical defense estimate2 open slots × No. 189.5 | 99.000 | 20% | 19.800 |
7.500 + 10.920 + 19.800= 38.220
Open-season rule: every unfilled slot uses No. 189.5, this player's stored replacement finish.
Averages, contributions, and totals are displayed to three decimal places. The ranking calculation keeps full source precision. Read the full method →
Full comparison · Career comparison
Understand the numbers
Start with impact, then compare playing time and skills. Team results add context. These are not categories to tally into a winner.
1 · Ranking evidence
Impact: who ranks higher, and why?
Career Impact Rank compares entire regular-season careers across NBA history. It combines average league places across the best three, five, and ten seasons, weighted 50%, 30%, and 20%. A lower rank or average place is better.
| Metric | Norm Van Lier | Phil Chenier |
|---|---|---|
| Career Impact RankPeak-weighted regular-season rank | #286Better result for this metric. | #302 |
| Best 3 average finishAverage league place · lower is better | 22.7 | 15.0Better result for this metric. |
| Best 5 average finishAverage league place · lower is better | 38.4 | 36.4Better result for this metric. |
| Best 10 average finishAverage league place · lower is better | 67.9Better result for this metric. | 99.0 |
Show more stats: Impact
| Metric | Norm Van Lier | Phil Chenier |
|---|---|---|
| Points-above-replacement rankAll-time rank in estimated regular-season points above replacement | #289Better result for this metric. | #385 |
| Peak box impactEra-adjusted points per 100 possessions above league average · higher is better | +2.7 | +2.9Better result for this metric. |
| Best 3 average box impactEra-adjusted points per 100 possessions above league average · higher is better | +2.1 | +2.7Better result for this metric. |
| Best 5 average box impactEra-adjusted points per 100 possessions above league average · higher is better | +1.4 | +1.7Better result for this metric. |
| Best 10 average box impactEra-adjusted points per 100 possessions above league average · higher is better | +0.5 | Unavailable |
| Points above replacementRegular season · fixed -2.0 replacement baseline · higher is better | +1,482 ptsBetter result for this metric. | +1,188 pts |
| Seasons ranked No. 1 | 0 | 0 |
| Top-five impact seasons | 0 | 0 |
| Top-ten impact seasons | 0 | 1Better result for this metric. |
2 · Playing time and responsibility
How much did each player take on?
Read games and minutes alongside impact. Offensive usage is the share of team plays a player ends with a shot, free throws, or a turnover while on court. More usage is not automatically better.
| Metric | Norm Van Lier | Phil Chenier |
|---|---|---|
| Games | 746 | 578 |
| Minutes | 26,171 | 19,116 |
3 · Individual skills
Where does each player have an advantage?
These are each player's averages across up to ten best seasons. Career Impact Rank gives the Best 3, Best 5, and Best 10 average league finishes 50%, 30%, and 20% window weights, giving the most weight to the highest peak. The model accounts for position, role, pace, playing time, and team results. Green marks the better result for a metric, including lower turnover rates. Workload and shot-selection measures stay neutral. These rows are not votes toward the ranking.
Shooting
True shooting includes two-pointers, three-pointers, and free throws.
| Metric | Norm Van Lier | Phil Chenier |
|---|---|---|
| True shooting percentage | 47.6% | 48.7%Better result for this metric. |
| True shootingAverage across the best impact seasons selected for the model input profile | 48.2% | 48.2% |
Show more stats: Shooting
| Metric | Norm Van Lier | Phil Chenier |
|---|---|---|
| Field-goal percentage | 41.4% | 44.4%Better result for this metric. |
| Three-point percentage | Unavailable | 40.0% |
| Free-throw percentage | 78.0% | 80.6%Better result for this metric. |
Passing
Assist rate is the share of teammates’ made shots assisted while the player is on court. Read turnovers alongside offensive workload; lower turnover rate is generally better.
| Metric | Norm Van Lier | Phil Chenier |
|---|---|---|
| Assist rateAverage across the best impact seasons selected for the model input profile | 27.2%Better result for this metric. | 13.4% |
| Assists per game | 7.0Better result for this metric. | 3.0 |
Show more stats: Passing
| Metric | Norm Van Lier | Phil Chenier |
|---|---|---|
| Turnover rateAverage across the best impact seasons selected for the model input profile | 29.3% | 12.1%Better result for this metric. |
Rebounding
Rebound rate is the share of available rebounds collected while on court.
| Metric | Norm Van Lier | Phil Chenier |
|---|---|---|
| Rebound rateAverage across the best impact seasons selected for the model input profile | 6.6%Better result for this metric. | 5.3% |
| Rebounds per game | 4.8Better result for this metric. | 3.6 |
Defense
Steals and blocks describe only part of defense. They do not capture every stop, rotation, or matchup.
| Metric | Norm Van Lier | Phil Chenier |
|---|---|---|
| Steal rateAverage across the best impact seasons selected for the model input profile | 2.6%Better result for this metric. | 2.2% |
Show more stats: Defense
| Metric | Norm Van Lier | Phil Chenier |
|---|---|---|
| Block rateAverage across the best impact seasons selected for the model input profile | 0.3% | 0.9%Better result for this metric. |
Scoring
Points per game describe scoring volume, not overall impact.
| Metric | Norm Van Lier | Phil Chenier |
|---|---|---|
| Points per game | 11.8 | 17.2Better result for this metric. |
4 · Team context, not ranking inputs
What happened with and without them?
A verified with/without comparison is unavailable for this scope. We do not substitute another season’s observations.
Four separate questions
Impact, winning, playoffs, and awards
These are different ways to understand a career. Only Regular Season Impact determines the hussEyquation verdict. The other three sections add basketball context without adding points or changing the rank.
Regular Season Impact
Norm Van Lier ranks higher in career impact.
Norm Van LierMetricPhil Chenier
#286LeadsCareer Impact RankPeak-weighted regular-season rank#302
+2.7Peak box impactEra-adjusted points per 100 possessions above league average · higher is better+2.9Leads
+1.4Best 5 average box impactEra-adjusted points per 100 possessions above league average · higher is better+1.7Leads
+1,482 ptsLeadsPoints above replacementRegular season · fixed -2.0 replacement baseline · higher is better+1,188 pts
This is the ranking result. It uses regular-season impact only. Team records, playoffs, and awards do not change it.
Team Success
The advantages are split across the available measures.
Norm Van LierMetricPhil Chenier
778LeadsListed-team regular-season wins671
0.5%Listed-team winning percentage0.7%Leads
8Leads50-win team seasons6
8Leads60-win team seasons5
5Playoff team seasons9Leads
Context only. Not included in Career Impact Rank. Final records for every listed team-season. A traded season can include more than one team.
Playoff Résumé
Phil Chenier leads every available measure below.
Norm Van LierMetricPhil Chenier
5Playoff appearances7Leads
38Playoff games60Leads
15Team playoff wins30Leads
0Finals appearances2Leads
0Championships0
Context only. Not included in Career Impact Rank. Team playoff results count only seasons when the player appeared in a playoff game.
Awards
Norm Van Lier leads every available measure below.
Norm Van LierMetricPhil Chenier
3All-Star3
0MVP0
1All-NBA1
8LeadsAll-Defense0
0DPOY0
0Rookie of the Year0
Context only. Not included in Career Impact Rank. Major regular-season honors are recognition, not inputs to the impact ranking.
How each context field is counted
- Listed-team regular-season wins
- The sum of each listed team's final wins in every season the player represented that team.
- Listed-team winning percentage
- Those team wins divided by those teams' total regular-season games.
- 50- and 60-win team seasons
- Listed team-seasons that finished with at least 50 or 60 wins. Shortened seasons are not projected to 82 games.
- Team seasons reaching playoffs
- Listed team-seasons in which that team qualified for the playoffs.
- Playoff appearances and games
- Postseasons and games in which the player appeared.
- Team playoff wins
- Team wins from those postseasons. They describe team results, not individual credit.
- Finals appearances and championships
- Seasons when the player appeared in the playoffs for the finalist or champion.
- Awards
- Recorded NBA selections and major regular-season honors. A zero means the source records none; Not available means the source field is missing.
Source and scope Basketball Reference, NBA seasons 1950–51 through 2025–26, accessed 2026-10-09.
Career Shape Explorer
How the careers developed
Follow every regular season by NBA experience or age. This view describes the path; it does not create another verdict.
Norm Van LierPhil ChenierPeak seasonHistorical source qualification
Estimated points per 100 possessions above that season's league average
Striped bars mark seasons with fewer than 40 games. A dashed mark means that player had no season at the aligned point.
Season-by-season evidenceRead both careers at the same stage
Every observed season keeps its age, era-centered impact estimate, league rank when qualified, career-stage label, and exact evidence link. A missing career point stays missing.
Norm Van LierNBA seasonPhil Chenier
Season 1
Season 2
Season 3
Season 4
Season 5
Season 6
Season 7
Season 8
Season 9
Observed values come from the accepted season comparison record. Historical source qualifications stay attached to affected seasons. Missing means no NBA season exists at that aligned point; it is never interpolated. Missing is not the same as estimated.